tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post546803822530512226..comments2024-03-10T10:40:32.319-07:00Comments on Pyromaniacs: The Conversation ContinuesPhil Johnsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00649092052031518426noreply@blogger.comBlogger55125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-41467128935711290092007-08-24T19:08:00.000-07:002007-08-24T19:08:00.000-07:00Jamie, I'm used to being judged harshly by people ...Jamie, I'm used to being judged harshly by people who don't know me. I don't like being on the receiving end, so I try not to do it to others (didn't Jesus say something about that? :))...but that doesn't mean I'm 100% successful at avoiding it.Helenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03605999794188527973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-60677013985171204982007-08-24T18:43:00.000-07:002007-08-24T18:43:00.000-07:00Helen,I thought that might be the case. I must sa...Helen,<BR/><BR/>I thought that might be the case. I must say it is somewhat surreal to be evaluated so sharply by those who do not know me. It is doubly humorous that the poster was inspired by a major typo and a lack of clarity. Alas...<BR/><BR/>Peace,<BR/>Jamie Arpin-RicciJamiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16669647390550990757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-32465315874375921432007-08-24T14:37:00.000-07:002007-08-24T14:37:00.000-07:00Oh, you're Jamie Arpin-Ricci? Sorry, I didn't look...Oh, you're Jamie Arpin-Ricci? Sorry, I didn't look to see who you were earlier.<BR/><BR/>As you say, you aren't one of the 'like-minded'.Helenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03605999794188527973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-89097886946860386212007-08-24T14:20:00.000-07:002007-08-24T14:20:00.000-07:00Helen,Since a comment I made on my own blog (which...Helen,<BR/><BR/>Since a comment I made on my own blog (which was unclear and contained a serious, but now corrected typo) inspired the second poster and the criticism of Phil's that you are quote, I can't exactly be cited as someone "like-minded" with Phil on this, so I guess I'll leave to others.<BR/><BR/>Peace,<BR/>JamieJamiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16669647390550990757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-64988856954099478672007-08-24T09:53:00.000-07:002007-08-24T09:53:00.000-07:00Hi Jamie, I guess it was to Phil but I'd be intere...Hi Jamie, I guess it was to Phil but I'd be interested in answers from anyone like-minded.Helenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03605999794188527973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-51479839490070810082007-08-24T09:49:00.000-07:002007-08-24T09:49:00.000-07:00Helen,Who are you addressing the question to?Jamie...Helen,<BR/><BR/>Who are you addressing the question to?<BR/><BR/>JamieJamiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16669647390550990757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-2666920540142367292007-08-24T04:30:00.000-07:002007-08-24T04:30:00.000-07:00In my assessment, that reflects one of the more si...<EM>In my assessment, that reflects one of the more sinister trends that's endemic in the ECM: a deliberate, systematic catering to youthful self-centeredness.</EM><BR/><BR/>I agree this can be a danger.<BR/><BR/>What's the biggest temptation you (not sure what you call yourselves) see yourselves needing to guard against?Helenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03605999794188527973noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-10513465363248126562007-08-22T08:15:00.000-07:002007-08-22T08:15:00.000-07:00Mike,We are actually in Millersville PA(in Lancast...Mike,<BR/><BR/>We are actually in Millersville PA(in Lancaster Co.). <BR/><BR/>SamSamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16385729083688529722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-35471848855849422742007-08-22T08:00:00.000-07:002007-08-22T08:00:00.000-07:00Sam,I'm also a NJ resident. Where's your church lo...Sam,<BR/><BR/>I'm also a NJ resident. Where's your church located? Web address?<BR/><BR/>MIKEMike Riccardihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06748453197783538367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-16109396719131562392007-08-22T06:05:00.000-07:002007-08-22T06:05:00.000-07:00Phil,On behalf of the pastors you met with, "Thank...Phil,<BR/><BR/>On behalf of the pastors you met with, "Thanks again!" for the great message on 1 John 2, the Q&A on the emergent church, and taking time to meet with us personally. I was reminded again of my responsibility to "contend earnestly for the faith." Bless you brother. Keep up the great work. <BR/><BR/>In Christ,<BR/>Sam WhickerSamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16385729083688529722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-18639577464660015082007-08-22T00:36:00.000-07:002007-08-22T00:36:00.000-07:00Cent:Now tell me: if the TeamPyro blog a "fundamen...<B>Cent:</B>Now tell me: if the TeamPyro blog a "fundamentalist" blog? If so, how is it "fundamentalist"?<BR/><BR/>Fundamentalism: Fundamentalists are <A HREF="http://teampyro.blogspot.com/2006/07/labels-love-em-hate-em.html" REL="nofollow">low-brow, angry, belligerent idiots</A> and we are not, so therefore we are not fundamentalists.David Chohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10635380194329897550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-7529858627102403142007-08-21T22:40:00.000-07:002007-08-21T22:40:00.000-07:00Unscrunched : I am not sure what the intent of you...Unscrunched : I am not sure what the intent of your post REALLY was but as a fundamentalist and NOT emergent, I found them quite hilarious. I truly had a good laugh about them. Humor is not just the domain of some.<BR/><BR/>Dave<BR/>dave1314.wordpress.comDavehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10123342591083738691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-61849835928695260712007-08-21T20:47:00.000-07:002007-08-21T20:47:00.000-07:00unscrunched, yours were pretty funny, i smiled at ...unscrunched, yours were pretty funny, i smiled at most of them. of course, those in the emergent movement have an inherent advantage in these types of situations. namely, those you satire have actual beliefs to parody.joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00407734824168297388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-66167199077836859182007-08-21T16:33:00.000-07:002007-08-21T16:33:00.000-07:00Scott,Your parody/satire/repeating-with-a-slight-c...Scott,<BR/><BR/>Your parody/satire/repeating-with-a-slight-change-to-make-a-point/whatever is missing an important component of my post. (That is, the satire is incomplete.) Namely, when I suggested you were misunderstanding something, I explained what it was. <BR/><BR/>That way you have the opportunity to consider my comment and evaluate it, and you could either accept the correction as valid, or point out something you think I'm missing. Or I suppose you could just read it and not respond, if you didn't think it important enough to respond to. Or you could ignore it. (That would be fine, I'm not so egotistical that I think every one of my comments <I>must</I> be responded to. I'm not that important.)<BR/><BR/>I have a hard time figuring out how to take the way you did respond. You don't seem to care whether I (or anyone else) has any idea <I>how</I> I misunderstood you. You seem to be content to say, in effect "You're wrong." I'm not sure what the point of your replying was at all.<BR/><BR/>Perhaps you could enlighten me?Jugulumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09932658890162312549noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-34349140365722793562007-08-21T15:00:00.000-07:002007-08-21T15:00:00.000-07:00Last one and then I have to go work a second job:I...Last one and then I have to go work a second job:<BR/><BR/>I am sure there is a story which refute <A HREF="http://www.reuters.com/news/pictures/slideshow?collectionId=912" REL="nofollow">this guy and his cult</A>. I'd love to hear it.FX Turkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16798420127955373559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-58150346257832672042007-08-21T14:55:00.000-07:002007-08-21T14:55:00.000-07:00Since this thread is getting a lot more play than ...Since this thread is getting a <I>lot</I> more play than my post today, I also wanted to note that <A HREF="http://www.lifeaction.org/soro/revivingthegospel/content/aliengospel.html" REL="nofollow">this is much more representative of Dieter Zander than the link Phil made</A>.<BR/><BR/>Notice how he is trying to talk about the work of Christ and the value of what Christ has done.FX Turkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16798420127955373559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-20724665329867944012007-08-21T14:46:00.000-07:002007-08-21T14:46:00.000-07:00I just wanted to say that for all their "turn the ...I just wanted to say that for all their "turn the other cheek" stuff, the ECM crowd have really turned out a very formidable patch of poster-worthy slogans -- and they proved me wrong: none of the ones I have seen so far have been porn, vulgarity, or blasphemy (although I'd think about the Jesus/Paul one before I repeated it to anyone). I was wrong and I apologize: they can actually make a funny.<BR/><BR/>The only one I take any exception to so far is "burn heretic burn", but if someone wants to call themselves a heretic, why should I argue with them?FX Turkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16798420127955373559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-26560833090008062882007-08-21T14:12:00.000-07:002007-08-21T14:12:00.000-07:00pro357:I, too, have noticed the penchant for pitti...pro357:<BR/><BR/>I, too, have noticed the penchant for pitting Jesus against Paul. Don't know what it is - must be something in the water they drink.wordsmithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13694767852556204886noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-7677469647482815692007-08-21T13:18:00.000-07:002007-08-21T13:18:00.000-07:00unscrunced said..."Jesus: He's no Paul, but he com...unscrunced said...<BR/><BR/>"Jesus: He's no Paul, but he comes close".<BR/><BR/>Am I the only one who feels this was a slap in the face to the Holy Spirit's capability of inspiring Paul.<BR/><BR/>This is a classic example of separating the Scriptures instead of embracing the truth in it's entirety.<BR/><BR/>I'm all for fun and creative comebacks; but this one was over the top!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-38042145121736557842007-08-21T13:09:00.000-07:002007-08-21T13:09:00.000-07:00unscrunched - thankyou for the first response to t...unscrunched - thankyou for the first response to the posters which has been mostly on target. Really good. Well, I laughed anyway. Are you going to put them on the posters?<BR/> I'd really like a copy of 'Spurgeon' and 'Proper exegesis' :-)Kayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14873728356115837593noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-4049032094039761652007-08-21T12:23:00.001-07:002007-08-21T12:23:00.001-07:00Fundamentalism: Because mustard seeds are just BE...Fundamentalism: Because mustard seeds are just BETTER than full-grown trees.<BR/><BR/>Propositional Truths: Because preachers suck at telling good stories.<BR/><BR/>Proper Exegesis: Because using too many words to explain away poetry and parable is just what we get paid to do.<BR/><BR/>Biblical Doctrine: Whatever people who lived in the 16th century say it is.<BR/><BR/>The Arts: "confused caveman groan"?<BR/><BR/>Real Christians: Not you.<BR/><BR/>Jesus: He's no Paul, but he comes close.<BR/><BR/>Christian Liberty: Church-Sanctioned UnChristlikeness! Woo Hoo!<BR/><BR/>Spiritualizing Cultural Taboos: How we get away with Church-Sanctioned UnChristlikeness! Woo Hoo!<BR/><BR/>Emerging Church: Gnosticism that accentuates bringing the physical senses into the...uh oh. Gnosticism that is too inclusive..whoops. I mean, Gnosticism that isn't cerebrial ENOUGH. Wait. I mean...um. Heretics.<BR/><BR/>Sola Scriptura: Because the word became text and was read among us.<BR/><BR/>Postmodernism: Because we needed a change from bashing Catholics and Penticostals.<BR/><BR/>Christian Attack Dogs: Wise as doves, harmless as serpents.<BR/><BR/>Cultural Relevancy: It's not like anyone in "Holy Scripture" had any. (Tears Acts 17 out of Bible.) (and the "all things to all men" passage.) <BR/><BR/>Susbstitutionary Atonement: Because big words make it sound more official!<BR/><BR/>Spurgeon: (adoring girlie scream and faint)<BR/><BR/>Pyromaniacs: Burn HERETIC BURN!!!!!! I mean, is not my word a consuming fire?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-81282440264372174182007-08-21T12:23:00.000-07:002007-08-21T12:23:00.000-07:00Phil,As my email to Tim tried to clarify, I can un...Phil,<BR/><BR/>As my email to Tim tried to clarify, I can understand how you would read my statement in the way you did. What I meant to say (and did not do so very well) was that there is a form of pride that manifests as self-loathing. If you cannot love yourself as Christ teaches (not in self-centeredness), it is difficult to love others.<BR/><BR/>Now, whether there is a deliberate, systematic catering to youthful self-centeredness in the ECM I will leave to you. Given my explanation, citing my comment as an example of it is inaccurate. If you were a frequent reader of my blog, I suspect we might disagree on a great deal, but I am confident that this "deliberate, systematic catering to youthful self-centeredness" is not something I am guilty of.<BR/><BR/>Peace,<BR/>JamieJamiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16669647390550990757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-49482446401962988982007-08-21T12:21:00.000-07:002007-08-21T12:21:00.000-07:00"the sort of evangelicalism the Emerging Church Mo..."the sort of evangelicalism the Emerging Church Movement is striving for is anabaptist”. Scot McKnight <BR/><BR/>“The emerging peace church movement is deeply influenced by some of the 20th century's greatest pacifists like Gandhi, Dorothy Day, MLK, and Yoder”. Jarrod McKenna<BR/><BR/>“Jarrod McKenna and friends are beautiful examples of this new breed of emerging integral leaders. I thank God for them. May their tribe increase”. Brian McLaren<BR/><BR/>“People want to open up questions. They’re asking questions about how we should understand our relationship to scripture: Is it inerrant? Is it true? And many of the emergent people are saying that Scripture may not be absolute and authoritative and inerrant, but it is the “senior partner” in the conversation.” Scot McKnight <BR/><BR/>I can't seem to put my finger on what all the confusion is about. If it looks like; smells like; taste like universalism, relativism, pluralism, etc. Than it is!<BR/><BR/>The above quotes are what the emerging church "conversation" is all about. If you do not agree with the above quotes, you are not part of the emerging movement. I would suggest a nice Baptist Church. I attend one in Winston-Salem and Pastor Hardy would be happy to help as you mature in faith. <BR/><BR/>I grow tired of hearing "my generation" needs a fresh outlook on "doing church". There are plenty of churches that are following the God-given guidelines for building a church and edifying it's members. <BR/><BR/>So please, instead of re-inventing, look again for a Bible-based, Christ-centered Church (I guarantee one exists in or near your community; otherwise God has failed to build His church in the last 2000 years)and walk away from the heresy of what the real emerging movement is about.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-51373231403982392712007-08-21T12:06:00.000-07:002007-08-21T12:06:00.000-07:00Let's try this again...Scott, as Jesus often used ...Let's try this again...<BR/><BR/>Scott, as Jesus often used parables in order to hide the truth, rather than to clarify it, and the apostles didn't seem to use stories much at all, I think your point isn't really a point.Darylhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01296029404229769941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-22013953385946220492007-08-21T11:18:00.000-07:002007-08-21T11:18:00.000-07:00Jamie:I linked the poster to your comment because ...<B>Jamie:</B><BR/><BR/>I linked the poster to your comment because of the undue stress you seem to place on self-love. You say, for example: "in order to truly love your neighbour, you need to love yourself."<BR/><BR/>That's a very stylish thought, but it's a spin on the Second Great Commandment I don't see in the Bible. Rather, the Bible assumes we generally practice self-love far more than we ought to.<BR/><BR/>Jesus' answer to this issue contrasts starkly with yours. He said, <B>"If anyone comes to Me and does not hate</B> his father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters, yes, and <B>his own life</B> also, <B>he cannot be My disciple.</B> And whoever does not bear his cross and come after Me cannot be My disciple" (Luke 14:26-27). There just doesn't seem to be much of that spirit of self-denial in your reply to Cindy.<BR/><BR/>In my assessment, that reflects one of the more sinister trends that's endemic in the ECM: a deliberate, systematic catering to youthful self-centeredness.Phil Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00649092052031518426noreply@blogger.com