tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post6134024482902987342..comments2024-03-10T10:40:32.319-07:00Comments on Pyromaniacs: How to forgive yourself: a Biblely appraisalPhil Johnsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00649092052031518426noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-10290989232808358242010-11-05T08:31:52.492-07:002010-11-05T08:31:52.492-07:00@David:
Glad to meet you! Take a look at Dan'...@David:<br /><br />Glad to meet you! Take a look at Dan's blog on Fridays. It will move up your priority list pretty quickly! ;)Aaronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15285043747501470199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-21647105812000170552010-11-05T08:29:00.320-07:002010-11-05T08:29:00.320-07:00...blog reading is low on my priority list.
ONOE...<i>...blog reading is low on my priority list. </i><br /><br />ONOES!!!<br /><br />We'll have to do something about that.<br /><br />(c;<br /><br />Welcome!DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-7155918903384626892010-11-05T08:27:39.806-07:002010-11-05T08:27:39.806-07:00DJP, Yes, I am new to your blog. I sometimes read ...DJP, Yes, I am new to your blog. I sometimes read it, since its in my rss feed, but with everything going on in life, I'm afraid blog reading is low on my priority list. <br /><br />Thank you for the clarification.David Pulliamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06956491409719443335noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-42540656195421528052010-11-04T06:02:43.074-07:002010-11-04T06:02:43.074-07:00David, I ask completely unsnarkily: are you new to...David, I ask completely unsnarkily: are you new to this blog? (We have had many Davids; it's a great name.) If so, welcome!<br /><br />The reason I ask is that it doesn't take long to discern than my use of that phrase is strictly univocal: I always and only mean what God says in His Word, the Bible.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-15847725107558008802010-11-04T05:41:19.739-07:002010-11-04T05:41:19.739-07:00Thank you for your post. I have one question regar...Thank you for your post. I have one question regarding how one determines what is a sin. <br /><br />You say that "sin is only sin because God defines it as sin. Sin is sin because God says it is sin." <br /><br />Why do you define sin as what God SAYS is sin? Do you mean that he's given it to us by his Word and/or through nature? Or do you mean that because he literally says it is so, then it is so? <br /><br />Clarification is important on this point because if you take on the latter position then you have to deal with questions of "if God were to say genocide was good, then is it good?" Obviously we would say no. Because of this, I find it problematic to base the definition of sin solely on what God "says," defined in the latter sense. <br /><br />Again, thank you for your post.David Pulliamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06956491409719443335noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-9940324883408142072010-11-02T22:42:57.236-07:002010-11-02T22:42:57.236-07:00This is the most common issue for which the Christ...This is the most common issue for which the Christian prisoners I encounter wish to be counseled - how to forgive themselves, as exemplified in this post: http://thelightheartedcalvinist.com/2009/10/27/the-old-i-cant-forgive-myself-bugaboo-arises-again-at-the-prison/<br /><br />It's a cryin' shame such secular psychological tools have entered the Christian community.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-9070490784427382132010-11-02T20:44:50.742-07:002010-11-02T20:44:50.742-07:00We categorize them sometimes as "the song of ...<i>We categorize them sometimes as "the song of the fool" or the "song of the adulterous woman," or some variation of those loveable characters from Proverbs. Easier topics to discuss with my kids than the nuanced but damaging messages coming from the other station. Sad but true.</i><br /><br />So true, and that strategy is some serious Pyro-Mom genius. I'm so stealing, er, Proverbs 12:15ing it. :)Rachael Starkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10781158372237369417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-70245644222232522602010-11-02T20:18:38.026-07:002010-11-02T20:18:38.026-07:00I recently posted this as a facebook status update...I recently posted this as a facebook status update:<br /><br />"Big raspberries to the"Christian" radio's message, "don't go around feeling guilty; just forgive yourself." Friend, if you are feeling guilty for something, confess it to God, forsake your sin, and ask for His forgiveness. Then live in obedience to His word. It will do wonders for your guilt."<br /><br />It is a major theme in the Christian pop culture. I was trying to find the little vignette that the radio station played that talked at length about guilt. I was rather horrified by the ultimate "forgive yourself" message.<br /><br />(Off topic, but I find that the Country music station in general is less offensive--the messages are at least clear. We categorize them sometimes as "the song of the fool" or the "song of the adulterous woman," or some variation of those loveable characters from Proverbs. Easier topics to discuss with my kids than the nuanced but damaging messages coming from the other station. Sad but true.)Merrilee Stevensonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12770625841767761025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-41571980188242825782010-11-02T18:23:31.916-07:002010-11-02T18:23:31.916-07:00Sir Aaron:
So true. It's all about the blood...Sir Aaron:<br /><br />So true. It's all about the blood of Jesus Christ.<br /><br />It's so easy to tell non-believers that there's nothing they can do to earn their salvation—that they must rather repent for their sins and believe that Jesus Christ has already paid the price for them upon the Cross.<br /><br />But it's much harder for us as believers to accept that there's also nothing <i>we</i> can do to pay back God for His grace; or to "earn back" God's favour after we have sinned. The remedy is the same: <i>God's</i> atonement for <i>our</i> sins by the blood of Jesus Christ, shed upon Calvary's Cross!<br /><br /><i>In that old rugged cross,<br />stained with blood so divine,<br />a wondrous beauty I see,<br />for 'twas on that old cross<br />Jesus suffered and died,<br />to pardon and sanctify me.</i>Stefan Ewinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05530690016594029847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-80896579967001619772010-11-02T17:43:11.002-07:002010-11-02T17:43:11.002-07:00Good post, Dan. Many times we forget that God is ...Good post, Dan. Many times we forget that God is the primary offended party. We then forget that the purpose of Jesus' death was forgiveness of our sins. Instead we recognize that Jesus saved us, but we think we need to pay some sort of pennace for our sins (as if we could). Thus, failure to "forgive ourselves" is really failure to recognize God as the judge of sin and that the penalty for sin has already been paid.Aaronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15285043747501470199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-17727415198545323762010-11-02T14:07:02.643-07:002010-11-02T14:07:02.643-07:00We could call the whole mess psycho-ology or bette...We could call the whole mess psycho-ology or better yet me-ology. (As opposed to a biblical theology, anthropology, soteriology...)<br /><br />Either way, a crazy man is at the center of it! And his answers are wrong every time.allenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12039108004526542211noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-33513474994218385022010-11-02T13:08:40.746-07:002010-11-02T13:08:40.746-07:00Faithful and just.
Whoa.
Never saw that.
Amazin...Faithful <i>and just.</i><br /><br />Whoa.<br /><br />Never saw that.<br /><br />Amazing how a single word can carry SO much significance!Stefan Ewinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05530690016594029847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-30254436012881251922010-11-02T13:01:19.420-07:002010-11-02T13:01:19.420-07:00I echo the others who hear this sentiment by profe...I echo the others who hear this sentiment by professing Christians (ahem, often, in my experience, of the double-X chromosome variety) a <i>lot</i>.<br /><br />1 John 1:9 is always my favorite go-to verse. God is not only faithful to forgive our sins, He's <i>just</i> in doing so. Questioning the completeness of His forgiveness, or His justice, by adding our work to it is yet another way we work to make Him less than He is, and ourselves more than we are.Rachael Starkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10781158372237369417noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-77439754116111735392010-11-02T12:54:31.171-07:002010-11-02T12:54:31.171-07:00Hm; the Wiki-force is strong with you.Hm; the Wiki-force is strong with you.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-17336029131365479102010-11-02T12:39:45.501-07:002010-11-02T12:39:45.501-07:00Actually, if you look at the original article as o...Actually, if you look at the <a href="http://www.wikihow.com/index.php?title=Forgive-Yourself&oldid=4422858" rel="nofollow">original article</a> as originally written by "1sweetchristian" and then <a href="http://www.wikihow.com/index.php?title=Forgive-Yourself&diff=5203136&oldid=4422858" rel="nofollow">compare it to the current version</a> as modified by other contributors, you'll see that her original post isn't really very far off the mark, theologically, and is centered on God's forgiveness.<br /><br />But the article in its current form does help to illustrate the way in which biblical concepts morph in a society which fundamentally rejects the biblical worldview.Stefan Ewinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05530690016594029847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-66989315362339131402010-11-02T12:30:07.131-07:002010-11-02T12:30:07.131-07:00If we "forgive ourselves" without seekin...If we "forgive ourselves" without seeking God's forgiveness, we're being unrepentant and self-absorbed.<br /><br />If we repent to God and trust in His forgiveness, yet continue to refuse to "forgive ourselves," then we're showing lack of faith.<br /><br />If we wallow in guilt and yet refuse to repent, we're just being stiff-necked.<br /><br />If we always feel guilty about everything, then we need Jesus Christ big time.<br /><br />...And if we never feel guilty about anything, then...we need Jesus Christ big time.<br /><br />So basically...we're all sinners who need the Cross of Christ!Stefan Ewinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05530690016594029847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-11449184100667401102010-11-02T12:21:50.460-07:002010-11-02T12:21:50.460-07:00Alistair,
One thing about the Wikihow reference t...Alistair,<br /><br />One thing about the Wikihow reference that <b><i>really</i></b> is relevant to a Christian blog is that a professing Christian contributed to the content. Outside of just the worldly content, we have here a young lady claiming the name of Christ and seemingly espousing the same thoughts.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13987985549747283669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-48283282023329988662010-11-02T11:59:48.155-07:002010-11-02T11:59:48.155-07:00Please don't take this comment too hard. I'...<i>Please don't take this comment too hard. I'm only trying to toady up to Dan.</i><br /><br />*Chuckle*<br /><br />I appreciated that a great deal Dan.<br /><br />I think struggling with guilt is so common. I talked with my pastor about it on occasion and he made what I think is a great point.<br /><br />Faith is trusting in God's promise. If I have confessed sin and repented of it, then when God promised "If you confess your sin he is faithful and just to forgive us our sin," then I either have faith that God in fact forgave me. OR I commit the sin of disbelief.<br /><br />So Faith ... Trust in God's promise! Including for forgiveness.Gov98https://www.blogger.com/profile/08591233575630981982noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-22535552503385750342010-11-02T11:47:05.905-07:002010-11-02T11:47:05.905-07:00Brad, thanks- I think your criticism is valid. I a...Brad, thanks- I think your criticism is valid. I apologize for not being clearer in my posts, as well as for failing to acknowledge Dan's valid points. I find nothing wrong with his reasoning, in fact, I agree with him wholeheartedly.<br /><br />He was using a simple example to make a valid and (more) important point, and the example he chose to make it with is of secondary importance. No issues.<br /><br />Nevertheless, I believe that the method of setting up (clearly) worldly notions for debunking is problematic in many ways. For one, it appears often to be a gimmick used to generate traffic on 'christian' sites (We agree that the world has it wrong, aren't we something?). Its frequent use - casually check some 'christian' blogs - very often also points to a lack of understanding of the Scriptural teaching on the ability of unregenerate men to grasp spiritual things.<br /><br />But that's all secondary to this post, so no need to reply as I am happy to bow out.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04736591524618497829noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-55289089801867558602010-11-02T11:21:49.398-07:002010-11-02T11:21:49.398-07:00In a more positive vein, when people are under the...In a more positive vein, when people are under the notion that they need to forgive themselves, that's a good opportunity to teach them "No, you need to acknowledge God's forgiveness of you (if that's the case obviously) and realize THAT'S the forgiveness you need, the forgiveness that brings healing and life."<br /><br />There are a lot of really hurting people who haven't been taught this truth, and need a gentle lesson. I can remember when it was first made clear to me, and that pastor had a big smile of joy on his face that made me smile as I realized the truth.~Markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01819856178499938127noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-26474611981668706372010-11-02T11:11:22.459-07:002010-11-02T11:11:22.459-07:00This is good. People, including professing Christi...This is good. People, including professing Christians, talk like this a lot. <br /><br />For the one who says things like, "I know God will forgive me, but I can't forgive myself," I've always appreciated David's declaration a few verses later in Psalm 51: "Cleanse me with hyssop, and I will be clean." It's not, "Cleanse me with hyssop, and I'll feel really bad about it till I decide I'm clean." It's rather being humble enough to accept God's gracious declaration on your life. It's pride that rejects grace -- even the self-pity kind of pride -- because grace insults the ego.<br /><br />This reminds me of Captain O-merica's statement that sin is simply "being out of alignment with my values," and that being "true to myself and my faith...is its own reward, [and] when I'm not true to it, it's its own punishment."<br /><br />Like you said, classic pop-psychology from the wisdom of the world.Mike Riccardihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06748453197783538367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-44809304875546732372010-11-02T10:29:28.049-07:002010-11-02T10:29:28.049-07:00...and i's working, big-time....and i's working, big-time.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-56560235105897335332010-11-02T10:27:42.369-07:002010-11-02T10:27:42.369-07:00Alistar,
I think your two comments today may be t...Alistar,<br /><br />I think your two comments today may be the oddest I've read on Pyromaniacs in a long time, and that's saying something. I was not under the impression that the point of the post was the debunking of WikiHow, it was simply a launching point/illustration of the main point.<br /><br />And, even if I am wrong and you are right about the point being the debunking of WikiHow, your comment is still odd. It turns out that this is a blog, that WikiHow is wrong, and Dan can debunk whoever he wants to, right?<br /><br />Please don't take this comment too hard. I'm only trying to toady up to Dan.Brad Williamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00197301845256854051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-6131820853586597052010-11-02T10:23:15.533-07:002010-11-02T10:23:15.533-07:00No profile Alistair, we forgive you for missing th...No profile Alistair, we forgive you for missing the point.JackWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16384160992033491748noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-64334862033012079612010-11-02T09:17:46.691-07:002010-11-02T09:17:46.691-07:00...as opposed to none.
WikiHow, along with countl......as opposed to none.<br /><br />WikiHow, along with countless other organizations and eager individuals maintaining public websites, do not appear to me to be the guardians of spiritual truth. <br /><br />How much discernment does one really need to know not to trust WikiHow on matters of forgiveness? I mean, <i>really</i>?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04736591524618497829noreply@blogger.com