tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post1198254244079062491..comments2024-03-10T10:40:32.319-07:00Comments on Pyromaniacs: Open Letter to Rob BellPhil Johnsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00649092052031518426noreply@blogger.comBlogger70125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-49542414646831828392011-03-28T22:41:03.725-07:002011-03-28T22:41:03.725-07:00I don't even want to concede to Bell the title...I don't even want to concede to Bell the title of his book. What Bell describes as "love" is a distortion of man. A more accurate title for Bell's book would be Sentimentality Wins. <br /><br />http://stayontargetstayontarget.blogspot.com/2011/03/sentimentality-wins-short-summary-of.htmlNate Archerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04071452115257992813noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-3852577977466371542011-03-27T18:04:38.726-07:002011-03-27T18:04:38.726-07:00Good letter! Thanks for pointing these things out...Good letter! Thanks for pointing these things out.<br /><br />Written by a friend of Rob Bell's (& parts of an interview) in his defense. Think of TULIP and then read on for the irony of the word heretic as he describes (also note: hell can't really exist for Bell because he thinks even after we die we will have the eternal? ability to choose God):<br /><br />While "heretic" is not a label that Bell revels in, it's not one that is altogether wrong, either.<br />The word's roots are in the Greek word 'hairetikos,' which means `able to choose,"' Bell explained.<br />Having been created by God with free will, we are all able to choose and make decisions for ourselves, including whether to accept the love of Jesus Christ and walk in the light of that love.<br />Essentially, we're all heretics because we all have the ability to choose.<br /><br />God put Bell here to tell people -- by any and all means necessary -- how much God loves them. And that there is nothing they can do to make God love them more or less. That is the "Good News" of Jesus. For too many people, though, what they've been told is the good news is actually an ugly truth. They hear that God is full of grace and unconditional love, a God of endless second chances, infinitely patient. But then they hear that God's grace, love and patience expires at death. "Too late," they're told. "You had your chance." That schizophrenic idea of God is simply untenable, Bell says."It's psychologically unbearable. No psyche can handle that," he said. "It's devastating."It's also toxic and a lie. The Good News, Bell insists, is better than that."If we have the freedom to choose these things now, that Jesus came to offer us and show us, then I assume that when you die, you can continue to choose these realities because love cannot co-opt the human heart's ability to decide," Bell said<br /><br />Link to full article: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cathleen- ... 35606.htmlshaunahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02178018532577154007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-50376666994854356162011-03-27T15:09:17.054-07:002011-03-27T15:09:17.054-07:00Doug, Mr. Obvious called and told me that John Pip...Doug, Mr. Obvious called and told me that John Piper meant exactly what you think he said even though you don't have the testosterone to express that point. For that Doug, you get a big DUH, LOSING.Otternamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03523261122537188230noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-81020308190274513822011-03-27T12:50:20.685-07:002011-03-27T12:50:20.685-07:00Pretty sure parts of it were Platonic.
Or, you kn...Pretty sure parts of it were Platonic.<br /><br />Or, you know, something.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-38203183041768721292011-03-27T12:37:18.224-07:002011-03-27T12:37:18.224-07:00I don't get the animosity towards Pagitt for h...I don't get the animosity towards Pagitt for his possible compliment to Piper. It is entirely possible that Piper was not merely pronouncing that Bell is way unorthodox, but also warning others that his false teaching will lead them to ruin as well. Does anyone have a problem if that's what Piper was saying? That's what pastors are supposed to do - guard their flocks against wolves and warn them against impending danger. So Pagitt would be correct to claim that Piper is being very "pastorly" - and we could only hope that other pastors follow such an example.<br /><br />That's assuming I'm hearing him correctly, of course. And if I'm not, I'll just take him to mean whatever I want, because I'm epistemically humble enough to not assume that there's only one meaning to what he said.trogdorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11452996348717802065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-80339068650368206092011-03-26T07:26:25.542-07:002011-03-26T07:26:25.542-07:00@Rachael Starke:
"Given the forum you have he...@Rachael Starke:<br />"Given the forum you have here, in doing so you've done a tremendous disservice to him, Bell, <strong>and the earth</strong>."<br /><br />That's the part where I choked on my breakfast.<br /><br />Well done.Jacobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17084189036334133951noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-47808675684837505022011-03-25T18:47:52.966-07:002011-03-25T18:47:52.966-07:00Excellent job Frank.
A heretic by any other name ...Excellent job Frank.<br /><br />A heretic by any other name is still a heretic.<br /><br />It's time for the people of God to rally to the blood stained banner of the gospel of the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ and stand firm on Substitution, Sacrifice and Satisfaction.<br /><br />What Rob Bell has done is no less than blasphemy. To deny Hell and to suggest universalism tantamount to explicitly stating that the death of the Son of God was unnecessary and that Jesus Christ died in vain.<br /><br />May our sovereign Lord have mercy on Rob Bell and grant him faith and repentance.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-75469927785174147332011-03-25T12:53:30.936-07:002011-03-25T12:53:30.936-07:00I haven't yet seen anyone point out the ultima...I haven't yet seen anyone point out the ultimate Bell hypocrisy: <br /><br />He makes his living from tithes and offerings by preaching things that don't need to be heard to people that don't need to hear them because they will ultimately be saved from sinfulness they really don't possess by a Savior they didn't even need when they were alive who died for no reason because he planned to save them regardless anyway, then writes a<br />book explaining it all to people that don't even need to understand it because (again) they're going to get saved anyway.<br /><br />Nice hustle, Mr. Bell.Unknown Posterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06104581211185469978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-61694701438770000772011-03-24T18:56:21.156-07:002011-03-24T18:56:21.156-07:00Open Letter to sum up Rob Bell's theology:
ht...Open Letter to sum up Rob Bell's theology:<br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olly_olly_oxen_free<br /><br />Frank you could have saved some time and snoozed on the plane.Bverysharphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10903164338818806414noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-56205880274978222982011-03-24T17:31:39.657-07:002011-03-24T17:31:39.657-07:00Great job! Definitely the best open letter so far....Great job! Definitely the best open letter so far.Lee Sheltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11254842261338255019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-38504751644458384752011-03-24T15:32:13.755-07:002011-03-24T15:32:13.755-07:00"If indeed the person who never hears the Gos..."If indeed the person who never hears the Gospel preached and who never knows for certain that Jesus is both Lord and Christ has nothing to fear from the Gospel, then I suggest to you that the person who thinks Hell is the place where people who reject Christ wind up also has nothing to fear from the Gospel – and your attitude toward him should be the same as your attitude toward others you perceive as unbelievers." -Cent<br /><br />Excellent point. Of course Pagitt will say your point is wrong for such and such, for he always has a way to say such and such about the truth.<br />These guys never admit they could be wrong, for they are not taking the Holy Writ in its simplest and purest context. And they do not care a hoot about Church histroy, unless it fits within their thoughts.<br />Some terrific comments here as well.<br /><br />Like Sundance said to Butch:<br /><br />"You just keep thinking Butch, that's what you're good at." <br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4beP5nKtruo<br /><br />"You just keep writing these letters Cent, that's what your excellent at."donsandshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03665794015011057098noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-91007754113530957472011-03-24T14:01:11.287-07:002011-03-24T14:01:11.287-07:00The one Bible passage that popped into my head whe...The one Bible passage that popped into my head when reading your post was Matthew 12:30-32. It is obvious that Jesus wasn't mincing words here. Mr. Bell could stand to read the NT again.<br /><br /><i>30 He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.<br />31 “Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. 32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.</i>JohnShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10830871658056946321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-19277352692699260022011-03-24T13:57:49.925-07:002011-03-24T13:57:49.925-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.JohnShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10830871658056946321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-1052913914966009492011-03-24T13:37:03.805-07:002011-03-24T13:37:03.805-07:00Great letter. I have been anxiously awaiting the r...Great letter. I have been anxiously awaiting the reviews to hit the blogs to which now there is no short supply (Kevein DeYoung did a 20 page released the 14th, a MUST read http://thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/kevindeyoung/ ) <br /><br />Rob Bell should take a long hard look at all the "intellectual hicks" who have biblically dismantled his alter of self and humanism and used the wood to feed the fires of Ghenna before he too follows suit.<br /><br />2nd Peter 2:1-3<br /> 1 But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does[a] not slumber.<br /><br /><br />I too pray God grants him repentence as well as the minions who follow him.<br /><br />Now pass the tators!Not Ashamedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01229118745427873095noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-8860661462823003392011-03-24T13:34:53.782-07:002011-03-24T13:34:53.782-07:00Eugene Peterson’s comments that
“there’s very lit...Eugene Peterson’s comments that <br /><a href="http://www.patheos.com/community/loveandjudgment/2011/03/16/eugene-peterson-would-jesus-condemn-rob-bell/" rel="nofollow">“there’s very little Christ, very little Jesus, in these people who are fighting Rob Bell”</a> are just as judgmental as the people’s he is referring to. The fact that he endorsed the book may be purely coincidental :) I say consider Rob Bell privileged because if he lived in the 15th century or so, his fate as a heretic would have been far grimmer than the pain inflicted from blogpost critiques. I am by no means wishing harm on the guy, but just saying that in times past he would have a lot more than ‘harsh critics’ to worry about. <br /><br />Having reached the saturation point of all things Rob Bell in cyberspace, I can’t help wondering how profoundly disturbing his post-mortem forgiveness thesis is. It defies even the common sense of justice in unregenerate men, let alone biblically minded Christians. Our justice system here is notoriously lenient on sentencing heinous crime. Some of our most classic news footage is the enraged relatives of victims decrying the lenient sentencing of convicted criminals because they don’t believe that the sentence reflects the gravity of the crime. The cliché of ‘justice has not been served’ is heard all the time. <br /><br />If you follow Bell’s logic through, you’d have to accept that the Hitlers of the world and the Pol Pots, pedophiles, rapists and serial killers will get slapped around a little but eventually get a big hug and a boarding pass from God on the other side. Is this not profoundly disturbing? <br /><br />Theological simpletons like me always understood that God’s wrath and eternal punishment provides the background for the good news. It is the <i>very</i> reason we can call it <i>good</i> news, otherwise the message of Christ’s forgiveness is just <i>news</i>. If you take hell out of the equation you cut the nerve of the gospel.<br /><br />As a closing note, one may be tempted to postulate that it is ‘pride’ to defy the understanding of the historical church on a fundamental doctrine as this. Were all these Christians on whose shoulders we stand, just deceived idiots and it took a post modern hipster to enlighten the masses of our generation?<br /><br />Since I am not a blogger or author and don’t have people following me on twitter, I am comfortable to say that the questioning of established truths is reminiscent of the Luciferian methodology deployed in Eden “did God <i>really</i> say that…?”John Nhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151182349424209838noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-72955568707562644432011-03-24T13:28:50.846-07:002011-03-24T13:28:50.846-07:00Alan Kurschner:
AHA!
Now what do you think of th...Alan Kurschner:<br /><br />AHA!<br /><br />Now what do you think of the NEW Calvinist Gadfly?FX Turkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16798420127955373559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-3392115026160732902011-03-24T08:55:52.168-07:002011-03-24T08:55:52.168-07:00Another thing. I think if we examine ourselves cl...Another thing. I think if we examine ourselves closely and with honesty, we will discover that a Pharisee lurks beneath the surface in all of us. Sometimes we have the wisdom from above to perceive and pummel it before it gets the best of us and is unleashed onto others. Other times we are not so discerning and that menace rears its ugly head and succeeds in its intentions.Darlenehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10566229104920123487noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-85392345878315566892011-03-24T08:14:03.437-07:002011-03-24T08:14:03.437-07:00A very compassionate plea and one that I hope Rob ...A very compassionate plea and one that I hope Rob Bell considers. Even though I'm not a Calvinist, I can appreciate the concern you have in regards to Bell's influence on the general populace-an influence that is misguiding and beguiling.Darlenehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10566229104920123487noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-30701169874130244512011-03-24T05:01:56.992-07:002011-03-24T05:01:56.992-07:00The old joke was that you could tell the differenc...The old joke was that you could tell the difference between an evangelical and a fundamentalist by asking them whether there were flames in Hell.<br /><br />The evangelical would hem and haw: "Well, what it's really trying to say is that it's bad." The fundamentalist would say, "Yes! Hot ones!"<br /><br />Bell and company would seem to say, "Hell? What's that?" And then mutter, "Probably some Platonic concept..."Mark B. Hansonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15942591774072214556noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-56322365639612888732011-03-23T21:55:52.057-07:002011-03-23T21:55:52.057-07:00Doug Pagitt is too impressed with his mind reading...Doug Pagitt is too impressed with his mind reading.Alan E. Kurschnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08963783504805163298noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-61121899482637073022011-03-23T20:34:30.690-07:002011-03-23T20:34:30.690-07:00I don't get what the problem is with Love Wins...I don't get what the problem is with Love Wins?<br /><br />If I apply the pomo emerg* hermeneutic when interpreting Rob's writings, I invariably find that his beliefs are entirely orthodox!<br /><br />In this case he clearing intends to convey that hell is a real place where unbelievers shall spend eternity. Simple.Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04558277131726233135noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-12965302299076311992011-03-23T19:11:17.634-07:002011-03-23T19:11:17.634-07:00My Word. Turk is now Khan Noonian Singh. I love ...My Word. Turk is now Khan Noonian Singh. I love it.Tom Chantryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02485908616177111150noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-39695174018364907482011-03-23T19:11:10.757-07:002011-03-23T19:11:10.757-07:00Great post.Great post.The Seeking Disciplehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10850752852586928341noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-51253590018751819572011-03-23T18:38:34.083-07:002011-03-23T18:38:34.083-07:00Hey Frank,
I am afraid I have to agree with Rach...Hey Frank,<br /> I am afraid I have to agree with Rachel. I know the world looks a little wonky right now, but Rob, Rachel, Dougie and I we had it under control and were that close to putting it all right again. <br /> And then YOU came along with your little blog post and did a "tremendous disservice to the earth!" Thanks a lot man, now we have to go back to the drawing board and start all over again.<br />"KHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNN!!!"<br />Sincerely (or maybe not),<br /> H. RexHideous-Rexhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15504615973869883092noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-53657434163489909982011-03-23T18:35:44.831-07:002011-03-23T18:35:44.831-07:00Well, duh.Well, duh.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.com