tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post6439117968186944400..comments2024-03-10T10:40:32.319-07:00Comments on Pyromaniacs: Subjective Impressions, ESP, and Reverse Deja VuPhil Johnsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00649092052031518426noreply@blogger.comBlogger111125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-1449759944429873752011-08-23T15:25:27.801-07:002011-08-23T15:25:27.801-07:00No, Matt, it is not food for thought. It is food f...No, Matt, it <i>is not</i> food for thought. It is food for distraction, food for itching ears, food for those for whom Christ and His Word are not enough.<br /><br />Have you not learned one thing, even yet?<br /><br />There is "food for thought" in Scripture you haven't even begun to deal with, or you wouldn't have come a breath away from total shipwreck <i>in this very thread</i>.<br /><br />Join the apostles, who were utterly uninterested in fascinating stories (even true ones!) in comparison with the more sure word of prophecy we have in Scripture. Stop despising prophecy, by moonily sighing over mists and illusions. Get in to the word, stay there, be content with God's lavish provision.<br /><br />This thread's done. If Phil wants to open it and manage it, answer Queue's question again, he of course is welcome to.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-82683320253975801102011-08-23T15:05:22.934-07:002011-08-23T15:05:22.934-07:00NCH,
That actually makes a certain degree of sens...NCH,<br /><br />That actually makes a certain degree of sense to me, and it would actually correlate with the testimony of Christians overseas. Wycliffe, for example, talks about how they see the gift of tongues manifest when they first come into an area, but once the Bible has been completely translated, the gift disappears. From your explanation, the same could happen in regard to prophecy.<br /><br />So the gifts could continue even until the present day in areas where the Gospel has yet to be translated, but is virtually absent (at least in its true form) from the places where the whole of scripture is widely available.<br /><br />This still would not completely negate the possibility of future prophecy or messages from God to His people in those areas, but it would be extremely rare.<br /><br />If my theory is correct, then the commands not to despise prophesies would still apply to us today when hearing testimonies of the works of God overseas. God may very well be using visions and signs to draw people out of Islam, for example, due to the great difficulty in getting access to Bibles in the Middle East. It is food for thought.Matt Aznoehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01886592758527878686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-60907462652024869302011-08-23T14:43:54.722-07:002011-08-23T14:43:54.722-07:00Q-
I'm not Phil, but a good reason is that pro...Q-<br />I'm not Phil, but a good reason is that prophets were given along with apostles for the foundation of the church so that the church would "build up...to a mature man" (see Eph. 2:20 and Eph. 4:11-13). So the church at Corinth was told to desire the gift of prophecy to be present within the body as whole. (I say this just in case you're unaware that it's not individuals who should be the ones earnestly desiring.) During the foundation stage of the church the NT wasn't around in a completed fashion. Therefore, prophets were given for the good of the church during its infancy. If this interpretation is accurate of the office of the prophet, then what we have of their ministry and their words are minimal, namely, the gospels of Luke and Mark, and the letters of Acts (Luke), Hebrews, James, and Jude (forgive me if I've missed one).<br /><br />I hope this helps you and I'm not overstepping my boundaries.Noahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14477982956306221086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-79108555232312092972011-08-23T13:54:09.525-07:002011-08-23T13:54:09.525-07:00Why does everybody always point to 1 Corinthians 1...Why does everybody <b><i>always</i></b> point to 1 Corinthians 14 and not use the rest of Scripture to interpret Scripture? I'll offer the same three portions of Scripture I did earlier and see if anybody tries to do so...<br /><br />"God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world." (Hebrews 1:1-2)<br /><br />"Aftere it was at first spoken through the Lord, it was confirmed to us by those who heard, God also testifying with them, both by signs and wonders and by various miracles and by gifts of the Holy Spirit according to His own will." (Hebrews 2:3b-4)<br /><br />"So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints, and are of God's household, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone" (Ephesians 2:19-20)<br /><br />Emphasis (for obvious reason, I hope) is mine for all of these.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13987985549747283669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-1249530741628385692011-08-23T13:44:28.171-07:002011-08-23T13:44:28.171-07:00Phil,
I have a question regarding your position ...Phil, <br /><br />I have a question regarding your position here: Were the Corinthians Paul instructed to prophecy (1 Corinthians 14:29-33) speaking the infallible Word of God when they did so? If so, why were they not captured and preserved for us in the canon? If not, why was it permitted and encouraged by Paul? <br /><br />Sincerely,<br />QJared Queuehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15508830376900126615noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-20886548651024540402011-08-23T11:21:18.865-07:002011-08-23T11:21:18.865-07:00Nope. As you have had the opportunity to read here...Nope. As you have had the opportunity to read here again and again and again and again, what you should do is:<br /><br />1. Believe what Paul said.<br /><br />2. Believe that the Corinthians should value prophecy.<br /><br />3. Repent of despising prophecy yourself as you do when you apply the word to non-prophecy.<br /><br />4. Repent of despising prophecy yourself by constantly "yeah-but"-ing the complete, sufficient prophetic Word of God.<br /><br />5. Value the prophecy <i>that is</i> the completed Canon of Scripture, to the point of being content with it, and starting your thinking there, rather than starting it with your restless, discontented itch for other than what God has given.<br /><br />6. Close your ears once and for all to the Serpent's constant whisper <i>to you</i> that what God has provided is not enough, and repent of not having done so much, much earlier.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-45872258792454278972011-08-23T11:12:04.050-07:002011-08-23T11:12:04.050-07:00Dan,
Perhaps I have overstated the case. I hold ...Dan,<br /><br />Perhaps I have overstated the case. I hold the Bible (the 66 books that we now have) as the absolute standard of truth, the very words of God with all authority. Given your understanding and definition, then I must renounce what I said. No writing since the formation of the scriptures by the eyewitnesses of Christ can be considered scripture in that sense. The Gospel is once-for-all delivered to the saints.<br /><br />But you have stated before that the prophecy referred to in the New Testament is exactly the same as that of the Old Testament. If this is true, what am I to do with Paul's exhortation to desire prophecy in the church or his command to not despise prophecies? These commands were directed toward churches whose people were not witnesses of the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, so their prophecy, while not scripture in the strict sense, would still be words from God. Am I to simply ignore these portions of scripture? Is the prophecy that he is talking about different from the prophecy of the Old Testament in a clearly defined way?Matt Aznoehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01886592758527878686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-88437664707059867082011-08-23T08:20:31.465-07:002011-08-23T08:20:31.465-07:00Manfred, thanks for noticing. (c:
Trogdor, excel...Manfred, thanks for noticing. (c:<br /><br />Trogdor, excellent hammer-dropping, as usual. I am convinced that most continuationists really don't think through their own position. Matt is an unfortunate example, and an example that no matter how many patiently (more so than I) say again and again "Wake up! Wake up!", it just isn't happening.<br /><br />So yes, you're absolutely right. The implication of Matt's position comes off of John 14:15 and 15:14 and all the rest. It means that if we reject anything in the hymns he still hasn't named, or the autobiographies he did name, or Pilgrim's Progress, we are marking ourselves as unregenerate, not loving Christ, and still under God's wrath.<br /><br />It's serious stuff.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-73184939316781956972011-08-23T08:14:59.539-07:002011-08-23T08:14:59.539-07:00I just the entire list of comments. Wow!
Bottom ...I just the entire list of comments. Wow! <br /><br />Bottom line, "Every time you criticize continuationism, God kills a kitten," is the cat's meow! As if there's something wrong with killing kittens - they are good tamale fixins :-)<br /><br />One of my favorite stories about the sufficiency of Scripture is the story of William Haslam. Taken from: http://www.williamhaslam.org/ It's a glorious testimony to how God works through His Word, for the glory of His name.<br /><br />One Sunday in 1851 following a period of deep conviction of sin, Haslam ascended into the pulpit of Baldhu church near Truro with the intention of telling his congregation that he would not preach again to them until he was saved and to ask them to pray for his conversion.<br /><br />However, when he began to preach on the text 'What think ye of Christ' he saw himself as a Pharisee who did not recognise that Jesus was the Christ, the Son of God. At that moment, the Holy Spirit breathed new life into him and the effect was so obvious and marked that a local preacher who was present stood up and shouted 'the Parson is converted' and the people rejoiced 'in Cornish style'.<br /><br />Others were also converted on that day, including members of his own household, others fled from the church in fear. A revival followed that blessed Sunday that lasted for three years during which time souls were saved weekly, often daily.Stuart Brogdenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05293983517209519257noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-50034305861588952522011-08-23T08:12:02.538-07:002011-08-23T08:12:02.538-07:00Back from a hectic evening, finally getting a chan...Back from a hectic evening, finally getting a chance to catch up on comments here. Did I miss anything?<br /><br />....WHAAAAA???<br /><br />DUDE! What... how.. huh? WOW!<br /><br />I mean, I knew theoretically there had to be people who held that kind of belief. I just never imagined I'd ever actually encounter anyone insane enough to express it (other than perhaps Roman cultists who believe something becomes God's Word when the grand poobah says it is).<br /><br />Is it inappropriate to suggest that those godly men and women would be absolutely aghast at the thought that someone would regard their writings as God's Word, binding on all men everywhere, condemning to an eternity of torment all who disobey and reject?trogdorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11452996348717802065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-28306773430035405922011-08-23T06:31:56.646-07:002011-08-23T06:31:56.646-07:00Sorry, puritanicoal. :( I just think it is importa...Sorry, puritanicoal. :( I just think it is important when we do have a quote to try and give the author. Glad you're on the Pyro team. :)Mary Elizabeth Tylerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08915438088186414796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-73267764483507554822011-08-23T06:22:50.434-07:002011-08-23T06:22:50.434-07:00Mary, I couldn't agree more with your last par...Mary, I couldn't agree more with your last paragraph. I wasn't the original author of that thought, and I don't agree with it - that's why it was in quotes.puritanicoalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01037018607747983203noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-23034370823031679292011-08-23T05:40:37.237-07:002011-08-23T05:40:37.237-07:00Dear puritanicoal,
You said: ""Benny Hi...Dear puritanicoal,<br /><br />You said: ""Benny Hinn is crazy. Benny Hinn is a continuationist. D. A. Carson is a continuationist. Therefore, D.A. Carson owns the craziness of Benny Hinn."<br /><br />I would be very careful with a statement like that, while it is true that continuationists are in error, not all c's are as extreme as Benny Hinn. To compare the two is just not a responsible thing to do. I have learned a great deal from D.A. Carson as I have John Piper.Mary Elizabeth Tylerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08915438088186414796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-91050822391541970192011-08-23T05:38:57.736-07:002011-08-23T05:38:57.736-07:00Puritanicoal,
I just gave you three Scripture ref...Puritanicoal,<br /><br />I just gave you three Scripture references over half an hour before your comment, yet you did not see fit to address any of those. I'm not saying to adddress me, but the Scriptures. Not one mention of experience.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13987985549747283669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-23190249593924833442011-08-23T05:38:26.151-07:002011-08-23T05:38:26.151-07:00Here's puritancoal, thoughtfully illustrating ...Here's puritancoal, thoughtfully illustrating the point of today's post.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-838176634434100572011-08-23T05:19:33.954-07:002011-08-23T05:19:33.954-07:00Another good source of information from a Cessatio...Another good source of information from a Cessationists point of view, is Professor Nathan Busenitz's article over at cripplegate.com, titled "Are There Still Apostles Today?" <br /><br />I mention it for two reasons. It is excellent and biblical, and he uses Wayne Grudem's very own words, who is a Continuationist.<br /><br />You can find it on page five at the bottom of the page.Mary Elizabeth Tylerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08915438088186414796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-78025652547980587122011-08-23T05:14:31.267-07:002011-08-23T05:14:31.267-07:00It's ironic how many cessationists argue their...It's ironic how many cessationists argue their point from experience. Those who supposedly revere the Word stay as far away from it (i.e., 1 Cor. 14) as they can.<br /><br />"I grew up a Charismatic, and they are a crazy bunch...."<br /><br />"Benny Hinn is crazy. Benny Hinn is a continuationist. D. A. Carson is a continuationist. Therefore, D.A. Carson owns the craziness of Benny Hinn."puritanicoalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01037018607747983203noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-62904623230804632242011-08-23T04:34:55.049-07:002011-08-23T04:34:55.049-07:00Just going to post a couple of things from Scriptu...Just going to post a couple of things from Scripture because I can't really speak better than it does...<br /><br />"God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, <b><i>in these last days has spoken to us in His Son</i></b>, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world." (Hebrews 1:1-2)<br /><br />"Aftere it was at first spoken through the Lord, it <b><i>was confirmed</i></b> to us by those who heard, God also testifying with them, both by signs and wonders and by various miracles and by gifts of the Holy Spirit according to His own will." (Hebrews 2:3b-4)<br /><br />"So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints, and are of God's household, <b><i>having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets</i></b>, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone" (Ephesians 2:19-20)<br /><br />Emphasis (for obvious reason, I hope) is mine for all of these.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13987985549747283669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-72958246292322320432011-08-22T21:54:46.921-07:002011-08-22T21:54:46.921-07:00Matt Aznoe.
Exhibit A.
1. That the “slippery-slo...Matt Aznoe.<br /><br />Exhibit A.<br /><br />1. That the “slippery-slope” is effective. <br /><br />2. Proof that sometimes a desire for “more” of Christ becomes more “than” Christ. <br /><br />3. Proves that sometimes people move beyond the gospel and only the gospel and fall off the other side.<br /><br />4. Proof that you can be sincerely wrong.Thomas Louwhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08406486510590654502noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-87703221899036835102011-08-22T21:14:41.392-07:002011-08-22T21:14:41.392-07:00"It is not for us then to select some gift, a..."It is not for us then to select some gift, and then look to the Holy Spirit to impart the self-chosen gift; it is not for us to select some field of service and then look to the Holy Spirit to impart to us power in that field which we, and not He, have chosen. It is rather for us to recognize the Divinity and sovereignty of the Spirit, and put ourselves unreservedly at His disposal; for Him to select the gift that “He will” and impart to us that gift; for Him to select for us the field that “He will” and impart to us the power that will qualify us for the field He has chosen." - R. A. TorreyJames Scott Bellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07641370124346172648noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-55877192382396925882011-08-22T20:11:56.063-07:002011-08-22T20:11:56.063-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Far Talkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09145322256644956946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-16174591355308179422011-08-22T19:22:10.229-07:002011-08-22T19:22:10.229-07:00The problem continuatist have is apostle envy. The...The problem continuatist have is apostle envy. They want the cool gifts(without the persecution the apostles had), they need proof to feel special.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-70389605751117591982011-08-22T19:16:37.521-07:002011-08-22T19:16:37.521-07:00Matt, here's where you are.
As I said, any po...Matt, <a href="http://teampyro.blogspot.com/2011/08/subjective-impressions-esp-and-reverse.html?showComment=1314057362843#c1906016504609230936" rel="nofollow">here's where you are</a>.<br /><br /><i>As I said</i>, any post that is other than a straight-up response to that post will be deleted. Keep up the same old, same old and I'll just make it simple and ban you.DJPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16471042180904855578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-35453163325393138692011-08-22T19:14:09.760-07:002011-08-22T19:14:09.760-07:00Matt:
You do remember George Mattern from Shepher...Matt:<br /><br />You do remember George Mattern from Shepherd's Fellowship? I know you do. Remember what he said about men who do not listen to other sound men of the faith?<br /><br />"But, if a person stumbles at the very easiest point of perception, and persists in error after a number of godly men have examined his conclusions and found them to be faulty in the light of the simplest Scriptural objectivity, then that person would do well to interpret that as a warning and a good reason to examine the motives of his heart. He should ask himself, "Am I so stubbornly set in my opinion that I am eager to mutilate the meaning of any Scriptural word, verse, or passage until it agrees with me, or am I approaching the Bible as the authoritative pronouncement of the God of the Universe, before whose majestic revelation I must always bow in reverent submission and constant willingness to change my opinions when corrected by it?"<br /><br />In other words, "Am I shaping the Bible with my opinions, or am I shaping my opinions with the Bible?" King David solemnly acknowledged to the Lord, "You have magnified Your ***WORD*** according to all Your name" (Ps. 138:2). Therefore, since "the Lord will not leave him unpunished who takes His NAME in vain" (Ex. 20:7), the same penalty certainly awaits all who would take His simalarly exalted WORD in vain by misusing it. Let every man sincerely examine himself in this very serious matter!"<br /><br />George is right! Listen to Phil and Dan, they care about your soul.Mary Elizabeth Tylerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08915438088186414796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-49203583450588463802011-08-22T19:02:05.742-07:002011-08-22T19:02:05.742-07:00Matt:
I'm a former Charismatic so I know the ...Matt:<br /><br />I'm a former Charismatic so I know the drill. Lets be honest. Lets get real.<br /><br />Charismatics all claim that Scripture, "is the authority against which all spirits are tested", but we know that's not true. You and I both know that Charismatics test everything against their feelings and any claim to the contrary just isn't true.<br /><br />It's time to for honesty brother. It's time to put away childish things.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com