tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post6909424216949044426..comments2024-03-10T10:40:32.319-07:00Comments on Pyromaniacs: Samson and Jesus: studies in contrastPhil Johnsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00649092052031518426noreply@blogger.comBlogger77125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-20581435091458910752010-09-19T03:58:43.680-07:002010-09-19T03:58:43.680-07:00Somehow, one way or another, Samson is a beautiful...Somehow, one way or another, Samson is a beautiful and wondrous picture of the person and work of Christ.<br /><br />That he's such a disaster and yet one of God's people,<br /><br />is sobering when one looks at the consequences of his actions, and yet gives hope that the love of God extends beyond what we can even imagine.<br /><br />Moralisms aside, he's yet another of the awesome and yet imperfect typological representations of the Coming One.<br /><br />Thanks for the post.Protoprotestanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18217567607160768261noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-39527781921232413262010-09-18T16:04:27.562-07:002010-09-18T16:04:27.562-07:00Two days late to the party...but just have one thi...Two days late to the party...but just have one thing to say:<br /><br />Bravo, Trogdor, on your 11:36 a.m. comment. Truly convicting. <br /><br />That is all. :)Susanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08289347868497438542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-85754910307157449642010-09-18T11:31:46.625-07:002010-09-18T11:31:46.625-07:00Very interesting article. I enjoyed it. I have alw...Very interesting article. I enjoyed it. I have always thought it rather amusing the way many think of Samson as a "Hulk Hogan" type of man. Given God's nature he was more likely a weakly looking fellow. After all, if he looked like Victor Mature, why did they ask were his power can from?boydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04578416298570988036noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-60392346333947117952010-09-17T22:52:19.174-07:002010-09-17T22:52:19.174-07:00While we're on the topic, how did Rahab make i...While we're on the topic, how did Rahab make it into the "heroes" of Hebrews 11?JSAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00681934865643964687noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-51529336371463256562010-09-17T20:54:27.217-07:002010-09-17T20:54:27.217-07:00Good post Brother.Good post Brother.Mike Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08047891023552453477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-31448031181548819252010-09-17T14:46:29.647-07:002010-09-17T14:46:29.647-07:00It is interesting, isn't it, that often it is ...It is interesting, isn't it, that often it is rightly said that Abraham's only qualification was his sin, which made him eligible to be chosen by God for forgiveness and to be given faith (which no sinner naturally has).<br />We have no problem pointing that out about someone like Abe, but suddenly it's hard to see Samson's complete selfishness and sin.<br /><br />If ever there was an example of God's sovereignty in election this is it.<br /><br />I wonder...if part of the thing is that we see ourselves in guys like Samson and King Saul and realize that too say that they were selfish sinners used by God, means that we too are selfish to the core.<br /><br />What have we done well, really?<br /><br />No more than Samson did. Nothing at all.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-79446283745122399402010-09-17T12:44:10.678-07:002010-09-17T12:44:10.678-07:00"Not just one of the faithful, but a hero?&qu..."Not just one of the faithful, but a hero?"<br /><br />I wonder if hero is the right word for some of these men of faith?<br /><br />And it's peculiar that the writer of Hebrews mentions "Gideon, Barak, Samson, Jephthah", all from the bbok of Judges. Yet he doesn't mention Deborah, who was the more valient person then Barak. And Jepthah, who sacrificed his daughter. And Samson and Gideon. These four are all close in the book of Judges.<br />So perhaps this writer was just reading that book, and they came to mind in this way. I guess not.<br /><br />Have a terrifci Lord's day, in His grace and forgiveness.donsandshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03665794015011057098noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-62278334230945602572010-09-17T11:34:36.553-07:002010-09-17T11:34:36.553-07:00Dan said: Honestly, I can't easy foresee anyth...Dan said: Honestly, I can't easy foresee anything anyone can say that will remove my shock that anyone would read the whole post and respond, "Wait, you're too harsh on Samson. What about Hebrews' passing reference to him?"<br /><br />Given that mine was the first comment referring to Hebrews 11 v 32, I think you misunderstood what I was asking.<br /><br />I can understand why you might think I was saying "Wait, you're too harsh on Samson", but I never said that. You read into my post something that wasn't there.<br /><br />Maybe I can restate what I was trying to ask: "In the light of all the valid comments you have made about Samson, why do you think Hebrews 11 v 32 refers to him as a hero of the faith? Not just one of the faithful, but a hero?"Dave Lhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03190093340114677632noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-40952831270829759492010-09-17T09:48:22.827-07:002010-09-17T09:48:22.827-07:00The embarrassing thing is that I am Sampson - only...The embarrassing thing is that I am Sampson - only without the mighty works wrought by God. O wretched man that I am.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15147021671506048314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-39459623149873468712010-09-17T06:06:10.594-07:002010-09-17T06:06:10.594-07:00David R. Thanks.David R. Thanks.David Kylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17709270641017787218noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-67329764659305687832010-09-17T06:01:41.948-07:002010-09-17T06:01:41.948-07:00Strat,
That's right. If any of the Judges or ...Strat,<br /><br />That's right. If any of the Judges or other leaders in Israel cause us to look at them as an example, rather than Christ, we're missing something big.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-28584081829330726412010-09-17T05:44:05.773-07:002010-09-17T05:44:05.773-07:00Looked through these comments yesterday after read...Looked through these comments yesterday after reading the post. It is quite a contrast between Samson and Christ, that's for sure. Samson was a hero of the faith at certain times, mostly due to his courageous fighting for Israel that he didn't shrink away from out of cowardice. But, he was totally despicable at lots of other times and tended to rely on his own wit and strength. In other words he's a lot like the rest of us. That's why we need to model Christ, who got the hero of the faith part correct and also left out the despicable part, and rely upon him alone for salvation rather than our own strength.Nash Equilibriumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06528684112014026512noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-61049846979341232302010-09-17T04:43:20.925-07:002010-09-17T04:43:20.925-07:00Daryl,
I certainly don't see much indication ...Daryl,<br /><br />I certainly don't see much indication of Samson continually crying out to God for help. In fact, there are only two instances where he is shown to say anything to God. In Judges 15:18, he sounds like the Israelites complaining to Moses when he tells God, "You have granted this salvation by the hand of your servant, and shall I now die of thirst and fall into the hands of the uncircumcised?" The other is when he asks God to avenge him in his death. <br /><br />That doesn't diminsh your point, but just wanted to make sure we're not giving Samson more credit than the Bible does. Most of the feats that Samson performed were due to the Spirit coming upon him and working through him of His (the Spirit's) own volition.<br /><br />Scott,<br /><br />I would recommend any Christian to work through Joshua and Judges. I taugh through these in Sunday School for 3rd-6th grade students and I think I probably learned more than they did. It is a very good study for any parent to do especially as it shows what happnes when we don't pass down the teachings of the Bible and compromise with the world around us. In fact, I'd say that it could even serve as a warning for those at BioLogos of what happens when we try to square things of the world with the things of God.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13987985549747283669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-80332739988770780352010-09-16T22:39:11.602-07:002010-09-16T22:39:11.602-07:00Thanks Dan for helping to lift the fog on my under...Thanks Dan for helping to lift the fog on my understanding of Samson. Care to do the rest of Judges? <br /><br />:)<br /><br />And a quick shoutout to Robert and trogdor for some very helpful comments to add to this meta.Scothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16573138499478048502noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-68072981956664725592010-09-16T21:55:04.317-07:002010-09-16T21:55:04.317-07:00Okay, I'm adding my $.02 after a full day of s...Okay, I'm adding my $.02 after a full day of stewing on it.<br /><br />If you can read the story of Samson with the Heb. 11 passage in view - giving full weight to the Christ/Samson contrast - without being undone to the bones by God's overwhelming sovereignty, then you've missed the story of the Bible.<br /><br />Read it again in fear and trembling. Don't look to Samson for relief, but to Christ for salvation.David Regierhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09766862583586784668noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-92166622923616476932010-09-16T19:31:39.279-07:002010-09-16T19:31:39.279-07:00Samson is so confusing...
I liked your post Dan, ...Samson is so confusing...<br /><br />I liked your post Dan, but here's my confusion. And it's probably more about what we don't know and how and why God does stuff...<br /><br />The whole story of Samson is full of sin and selfishness and in the midst of it, while doing or planning on doing selfish, sinful stuff, Samson keeps crying out to God to help him...and God does, over and over.<br /><br />That's what I find so confusing.<br /><br />But then again...God answers prayers and never leaves me and I'm no model of Christian virtue...<br /><br />The whole story of Samson is so conflicted it seems, yet there he is, in the Hall of Faith, proving yet again that God chooses whoever he wills, without asking permission or anything...<br /><br />Thanks be to God that he still works that way.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-90632141774850862010-09-16T17:28:58.172-07:002010-09-16T17:28:58.172-07:00Dan, This was a great post. Samson was no Hercule...Dan, This was a great post. Samson was no Hercules--strong, dumb, yet good hearted. The scriptures do not give a pretty picture of him, even in light of what Apollos wrote in Hebrews. Thanks for the reminder that, while the scriptures point to Christ, not everyone is a Boaz.Magister Stevensonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15507216978994361047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-47478005033977044712010-09-16T17:18:59.657-07:002010-09-16T17:18:59.657-07:00...thank you, brad and robert; you lifted my spiri......thank you, brad and robert; you lifted my spirits this evening with your reminder and encouragement: our help and salvation are in Christ Jesus!...mehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13138770527452248762noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-39459244961589520662010-09-16T12:33:10.944-07:002010-09-16T12:33:10.944-07:00I'm right there with you, Brad. I have my own...I'm right there with you, Brad. I have my own battles with pride and am very thankful that I don't have to contend with that kind of power. We are all sinners...we all need the gospel...every single day of our lives. While we may exhibit faith, I can say for myself that I see where I don't exhibit faith in God more than where I do...and even then I feel it is so small in light of what it should be.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13987985549747283669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-47211133223546354302010-09-16T12:25:33.410-07:002010-09-16T12:25:33.410-07:00Gah!! For clarity, let me confess that I'm in ...Gah!! For clarity, let me confess that I'm in the "Samson is a Loser" camp with both feet, both interpretively and literally. That is, I speak of that which I know because I'm <i>in the loser camp with him.</i> I confess that no sin overtook Samson of which I have not also been guilty. And I will confess further that if I had the physical strength he possessed, I would probably have been ten times the ogre he was.Brad Williamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00197301845256854051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-17783267654257839352010-09-16T12:22:24.618-07:002010-09-16T12:22:24.618-07:00Paul,
I am under the notion that the entire Bible...Paul,<br /><br />I am under the notion that the entire Bible, from Genesis forward, is a book about faith in the One True God as our only hope of righteousness. So I read Judges in light of Genesis and the example left by Abraham, amongst other things in Genesis and the Pentateuch. In light of that, much of what Samson does has me pulling my hair out. I see a man, living rather selfishly, to whom God is continually faithful, just as he is to the rest of His people despite their sins. That is the entire point of the Bible, not just Judges. <br /><br />You are trying to go back into the narrative and figure out which of Samson's actions are commendable by God and which aren't. That is very difficult, if not impossible, and it completely misses the point of Samson's example. I never said that he didn't do faithful things, that simply isn't the thrust of his story in Judges. Nor is it Lot's in Genesis. But the author of Hebrews sees their faith as commendable despite their wretchedness.<br /><br />And having said that....<br /><br />JS Allen, <br /><br />When you say that we want to be as far from the "Samson" end of the spectrum as we can, well, I say, "Good Lord, I'm in his spectrum! Have mercy!" Samson isn't an idiot. He's a sinner, and until we can identify with that, we will not cry out to God for mercy like he did in his final, flawed hour.Brad Williamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00197301845256854051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-78049777364400413352010-09-16T12:13:10.647-07:002010-09-16T12:13:10.647-07:00Jesse - thanks for the helpful comment, I had read...Jesse - thanks for the helpful comment, I had read your earlier comment but had forgotten it - I wouldn't have classified you as in the 'Samson was a loser' camp but somewhere in the middle. Things to learn, things to avoid.<br /><br />verification: versesPaulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06846458475646782293noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-10283403953410729342010-09-16T12:12:48.486-07:002010-09-16T12:12:48.486-07:00Paul: or to paraphrase Dale Davis, Samson may have...Paul: or to paraphrase Dale Davis, Samson may have been a lustful ogre, but he was God's ogre, while Israel as simply pagan.Jessehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02006325636921600509noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-46109787092631124592010-09-16T12:10:44.807-07:002010-09-16T12:10:44.807-07:00Can you take any encouragement from the thief on t...Can you take any encouragement from the thief on the cross?trogdorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11452996348717802065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21212024.post-72356309529762397082010-09-16T12:09:35.433-07:002010-09-16T12:09:35.433-07:00Paul,
I am from the "Samson was a loser camp...Paul,<br /><br />I am from the "Samson was a loser camp." In a comment above I pointed out how I see Samson pointing to Jesus, which is one place I am encouraged by the narrative, although not by Samson. Ultimately, Samson lived in an age where Israelites were practically pagan, and literally faithless. In the midst of that, God chose this man to deliver Israel. He was lustful and sexually immoral, he married a pagan, and yet when it came down to it, Samson fought the Philistines while the Isralites fought Samson. In that sense, much like Jephthah, he is an example of faith, but not a model of faith.Jessehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02006325636921600509noreply@blogger.com