26 January 2010

Un-signing the Manhattan Declaration: a PSA from Pyro

by Dan Phillips

As you know, the "Manhattan Declaration" (hereafter MD) was a bad idea that became a bad document that undeservingly boasted some very good names.

In our various discussions, many regretted having signed the document. They had, at first, understandably seen wisdom in co-belligerency in opposing abortion, the loss of freedoms, and the forced normalization of perversion. However, they had missed the deliberate muddling of the vitally-important edges of the Gospel. Now they wanted to un-sign.

But how to do so?

In answer comes a reader, John Taylor, who emailed me to let me know that he had both asked that his name be removed, and had received a response. He said I could share the saga with you.

So, for you who've wondered how: go to this page, and request that your name be removed. [UPDATE: that is now a dead link. I'll update when someone gives me, or I find, a valid URL.]

It took a while for John. He submitted his first request to that link on November 23rd of last year. Receiving no response, twenty days later he wrote a follow-up email (December 12). It was not until January 19 that he received a response — some 58 days after his first request.

In this email, they write: "We will remove your name from the list of signers, but it may take a few days."  This makes us both wonder if they only removed his name after two requests.

Perhaps the "takeaway" there is that you should ask them to acknowledge your request; and then, if you've received none in a few weeks, ask again.

On January 20, I wrote the email address John gave me, asking (1) the best way to get one's name removed, and (2) how many have asked that their names be removed. No answer yet. If I receive a helpful response, I'll likely update this or post it.

Dan Phillips's signature

23 comments:

Derek Joseph said...

Thank you for this!

Real Truth Matters said...

Have any of the writters of the Manhattan Declaration publicly responded to the criticisms over their view of the Gospel?

http://realtruthmatters.blogspot.com/

-joe said...

I also requested to be removed around then end of November (I can't remember the exact day) and received this response on January 7th:

"Dear Joseph,

Thank you for your request. Sorry for the delay in answering your email, we've had a tremendous response to the Declaration. We are sorry for your decision to have your name removed from the signers of the Manhattan Declaration. We will remove your name from the list of signers, but it may take a few days.

We will continue to ask everyone to read the Manhattan Declaration in its entirety and, if it resonates with their own convictions, to join us in endorsing it.

Thank you,

Manhattan Declaration"

I think we need to extend grace to the organization (consider others better than ourselves.) I'm sure they were overwhelmed with emails (good and bad) and with several hundred thousand signatures it was probably not an easy task to remove a name.

I'm thankful they responded and honored my request.

-joe

DJP said...

Joe, my concern was that it took John two times, and the response to the second was that it would take a few days (i.e. they hadn't done anything after the much-earlier first request).

But maybe that's just a form-letter.

I surely do HOPE they're flooded with requests for removal. I still hope that some of the high-profile names would make that request. Perhaps one would serve to encourage the rest to follow.

That document doesn't deserve those great names.

Caleb Kolstad said...

Thanks for this. Way to go JT. Humility equals true greatness!

Barbara said...

I'm one of those who requested my name be removed some time back, and I got the same response about a week later, though I don't begin to know whether or not it was actually done. I did grant them the benefit of the doubt on that.

Chris Roberts said...

It is a sign of the MD's longevity that I had already forgotten about the thing. I guess 410,000 signatures hasn't exactly resulted in anything being, you know, done.

Citizen Grim said...

Oh no, this'll just get TUAD going all over again...

Phil Johnson said...

I love the Sitting Bull graphic.

DJP said...

Since you lamented to Guy Davies that the same graphics keep getting re-used, I've been making an extra effort to go afield. Just for you.

Must say, though, some of the new, unused graphics are so great that I'm going to have to try to write better, just to merit their use.

Frank Turk said...

Since it came up, I think we should scrap all the graphics in the test site right now as well-aged and start over. There are a handful of classics up there, so if you have any you just can't part with, Phil, I get it.

But my opinion is that we're a little stagnant up there -- especially the bottom 2-3rds.

DJP said...

I disagree. So there.

philness said...

Just seems like a wasted opportunity to stand up and participate in some hard work by not signing the MD.

Its like calling into work to be removed from the work schedule because some undeserving folks upstairs sitting in hard wall offices and nice cubicles, who haven't obtained their proper credentials as I perceive, don't believe in Jesus and the ones that do are way off base from what I believe.

Yeah that'll go over real well with the boss.

Or maybe the boss would say, "son, that's just fine, you'd probably create more harm any way’s. And its no secret this here company is a sinking ship, but we're gonna continue to stay on course, son. But if you feel you’re not up to it or the work too hard, or your status tarnished, well, while you get in that there now 33%unemployment line, know that its these folks that will be paying your benefits. You take care kid. Oh, don't forget that purdy diplomatic school'n certificacion you got hung up down there."

chrish said...

philness:
One breakdown of your analogy is that we're not called to only work for money with Christians, nor is our work (generally) focussed on the Gospel.

If it is, then you had better be certain of the people with whom you put shoulder to plough; you may find yourself reaping a very different harvest than the one you'd hoped.

philness said...

chrish,

I agree. The analogy doesn't pertain to working for wages but rather for soles for the Kingdom. And if that means making sandwiches along side a Catholic for the needy. I see a double opportunity to both clarify the gospel and share the gospel.

DJP said...

Philness, you seem to be commenting on an issue without having taken the time to get up to speed. Please refrain. There's a link in the post, and the topic is tagged.

philness said...

Dan,

Yes sir. I shall go there now.

DJP said...

Okey-doke — if you want to. No one has to, including you. But if you're going to comment on something, it's a good idea (to say no more than that) to be engaging at around the same level as the general conversation; and this is a conversation that has long-since moved well beyond the "are the issues surrounding the MD important issues?" phase.

Alexander M. Jordan said...

I wrote to the Manhattan Project on Dec 4 about getting my name removed and heard back from them on January 11th. I received the same message others have quoted.

At least they are responding to these requests.

DJP said...

Yep, that's good.

Hope I get an answer to my inquiry — if they're keeping a tally. They certainly are on the "plus"-side.

SamWise said...

I'm not sure that I didn't sign the MD. I do know that a FB friend sent me a link to a FB group which I have since "left." My fault for taking a friend's eager plea instead of reading competely by myself!

Is there a way to find out if I did. I went to the site and couldn't see a way to search!???

Thanks Dan for the Rebuke!

In the Lamb,

Rafe

philness said...

Dan,

I'm trying to answer a lot of the questions with, Yeah..but..., or No...but... and its not working out too well for me. I would like to believe that I could sign if I go in with the fact that who am I to judge if their Christians or not. I'm here to work, share the gospel and clarify the gospel. But that's not working out to well for me either.

I think I see the bigger issue now.

Sorry. Forgive me, please. Please delete my previous comments if you want. Or keep them as a bad example for maybe someone else if you see fit. Either way- it is well with my soul.

Come soon Lord Jesus.

DJP said...

I think going in to work is great, Phil; and your desire to work on those issues is a good desire. There are ways we can work with Roman Catholics, Mormons, Hindus, whoever.

The thing about that document is that it commits you (if you sign) to saying that Roman Catholics and Orthodox are Christians who preach the Gospel. Just by knowing their Roman Catholics and Orthodox, that makes them Gospel-preaching Christians, in terms of the document.

That's quite a bit different from saying that there may be a few folks saved in spite of the official positions of those churches.